Body Language Expert: “People Won’t Like You If Do This!” | Vanessa Van Edwards

In this podcast episode, Vanessa Van Edwards, a renowned behavioral researcher and expert on body language, presence, and communication, explores the powerful dynamics of charisma, warmth, and competence in interpersonal interactions. She delves into how people's physiological responses are affected by nonverbal cues, the delicate balance required to be both likable and respected, and the darker side of charisma when misused by narcissists. Vanessa offers practical advice on managing social rejection, reading subtle cues, leveraging gesture and vocal power, and maintaining authenticity, especially when dealing with difficult or toxic people.

Warmth and Competence: The Foundations of Charisma

Vanessa emphasizes that true charisma arises from a perfect balance of warmth and competence. She explains that people problems largely stem from an imbalance between these two traits, where excessive competence can come across as cold or intimidating, while excessive warmth without competence can reduce credibility. Charisma essentially answers two rapid-fire questions the brain asks upon meeting someone: "Can I trust you?" and "Can I rely on you?" Vanessa stresses that both warmth (trustworthiness) and competence (reliability) must be signaled early, especially in our increasingly virtual world where many first impressions happen via video or LinkedIn.

The Power of a Genuine Smile

Discussing the nuances of smiling, Vanessa highlights research showing that a "real" smile is identified by engagement of the eye muscles—creating visible crinkles around the eyes—rather than whether teeth are shown. Authentic smiles trigger contagious happiness in others, while fake smiles do not affect mood. She encourages either neutral expressions or those with eye crinkles in profile pictures and warns against the "in-between," unconvincing smile that can undermine trust.

Recognizing and Managing Nonverbal Cues of Social Rejection

Vanessa explores common nonverbal signals of social rejection such as eye rolls, looking away, crossing arms, distancing behaviors, and shifting feet. She explains that when people perceive rejection cues, their field of vision expands and pupils dilate, preparing them to seek escape or other social cues. This physiological response raises adrenaline and cortisol levels, impairing cognitive function and potentially wrecking presentations or social engagements. Labeling or naming such cues—"That was an eye roll"—calms the amygdala and helps regain composure, providing a powerful tool for maintaining confidence and control under social pressure.

The Lid Flex: A Subtle Cue of Focus and Interest

A fascinating subtle body cue Vanessa discusses is the "lid flex," a slight tightening of the lower eyelids. Unlike the fear cue of widened eyes, a lid flex reduces light intake, allowing for better focus and detailed observation. This cue is often perceived as deeply attentive or scrutinizing, making it attractive and powerful in social interactions such as negotiations or dates. Recognizing and responding to lid flexes can help guide conversations and signal receptivity.

The Importance of Hand Gestures and Openness

Vanessa's research analyzing nearly 500 "Shark Tank" pitches shows that visible, relaxed hands and open gestures dramatically increase perceptions of trust and competence. Hidden hands, clenched fists, or crossing arms can cause distrust or signal defensiveness. Gesturing not only underlines speech for listeners, making the message clearer and more compelling, but also reduces cognitive load for the speaker, improving fluency and confidence. She cautions against overusing flashy or exaggerated gestures, recommending natural, relevant hand movements as "body language highlighters."

Triggering Dopamine and Engaging Audiences

Another insight from Vanessa's analysis of business pitches is the importance of sparking dopamine—the brain's motivator and pleasure chemical—to increase audience engagement and enthusiasm. Introducing surprises, interactive elements, or sensory experiences (like tasting a product) in presentations awakens interest and motivation. Even simple achievement-oriented words like "win," "succeed," or "master" can prime people to perform better and sustain effort longer, demonstrating how word choice directly affects physiology and outcomes.

The Subtle Art of Social Priming Through Language

Vanessa talks about how the words we choose in emails, introductions, and conversations subconsciously prime others for warmth or competence. For example, excess warm language or emojis in professional communication can reduce credibility and delay responses, while strategic competent language can boost trust and influence. She encourages balancing warmth and competence in messaging, such as complimenting mutual connections or highlighting achievements succinctly to stimulate dopamine and connection simultaneously.

Charisma Versus Narcissism: Spotting Danger Zone Cues

Addressing the fine line between genuine charisma and manipulative narcissism, Vanessa reveals one of her greatest concerns: the misuse of social skills for selfish gain. She explains there are "danger zone cues" that betray bad intentions and guilt, such as lip pursing, distancing behaviors, increased blink rate, and inconsistent emotional expression. These cues are difficult to control and leak despite attempts to fake warmth or competence. Vanessa cites notorious examples like Lance Armstrong and Elizabeth Holmes to illustrate how faking competence or warmth eventually collapses under pressure.

Dealing with Toxic People Authentically

Vanessa advises against faking warmth with toxic individuals, as it drains one's authenticity and leads to a harmful loss of integrity over time. Instead, she suggests setting firm boundaries and focusing on demonstrating competence—getting tasks done efficiently and professionally—rather than forcing false friendliness. When confrontation or removal isn't immediately possible, doubling down on task-based interactions rather than social niceties protects one's energy and effectiveness.

Best Practices for Video and In-Person Presence

Vanessa discusses how physical space or "social zones" affect perceptions of warmth and trust. She warns that video calls often break natural spatial cues by placing faces too close to the camera, which can feel invasive or exhausting. Ideally, one should maintain a distance of about 18 inches to 3–4 feet (the social zone) to preserve comfort and rapport. Additionally, showing hands during video interactions increases trust since concealed hands trigger suspicion in our primal brains.

Vocal Power, Inflection, and Pausing

Vocal characteristics profoundly influence perceptions of charisma and leadership. Vanessa highlights the pitfalls of "uptalk," where statements end in a raised intonation, causing listeners to question confidence and truthfulness. By contrast, downward inflections convey authority and competence. She also explains how vocal fry (a creaky voice) emerges from tension and insufficient airflow and suggests speaking with a louder volume to mitigate it. Power pauses—strategic breaks before delivering important points, rather than at sentence ends—build intrigue and reduce interruptions.

Nonverbal Leadership Cues and Historical Examples

Drawing on the Nixon-Kennedy debates, Vanessa illustrates the impact of classic body language cues on leadership perception. Nixon's closed, tense posture and physical discomfort undermined his image, while Kennedy's relaxed "humility hands" and open posture conveyed calm confidence and engagement. She emphasizes the importance of open postures, expansive physical presence (e.g., increased ear-to-shoulder distance), and relaxed shoulders for projecting leadership. She also references artworks like Da Vinci's "The Last Supper" to show the centuries-old recognition of balance between open, inviting palms and competent, directive palm-down gestures.

The Influence of Hand Gestures in Politics

Vanessa explores how effective politicians, like Barack Obama, use subtle hand gestures—such as the "thumb pinch," which adds both warmth and authority—and vocal dynamics, including careful volume fluctuation and downward inflection, to command presence. These gestures signal competence without aggression and help forge connection with audiences.

Authenticity and Healing as Foundations for Charisma

Vanessa closes with a reminder that personal healing and emotional regulation underpin successful communication and charismatic presence. Without managing past traumas and triggers that provoke reactive behavior, it becomes difficult to reliably send warmth and competence cues. Ultimately, she advocates for continuous learning about human behavior, genuine empathy, and speaking with both the heart and scientific understanding to truly influence and connect.