Who Is Michael Cohen? | PBD 728

In this podcast episode, Michael Cohen, former personal attorney and fixer for Donald Trump, provides an extensive and candid account of his relationship with Trump, the pressures and betrayals he experienced, his legal battles, insights into Trump's character and dealings, and his current stance on politics and personal trust. Cohen also addresses controversies surrounding him, his views on the justice system, and shares thoughts on broader political issues including university litigations, immigration, international affairs, and criminal justice reform.

Relationship with Donald Trump

Michael Cohen begins by emphasizing the deep and long-standing relationship he had with Donald Trump, describing himself as having spent roughly 50,000 hours with Trump over more than a decade. Cohen recounts how he admired Trump from a young age and eventually became his personal attorney and confidant. He highlights moments that show Trump's loyalty, his knowledge of sports, and personal anecdotes such as attending baseball games with his son. Despite the eventual fallout, Cohen expresses that he still loves Trump and feels betrayed by the way their relationship ended, particularly because Trump did not protect him when prosecutors targeted him. Cohen stresses that he would have taken a bullet for Trump, with the exception of if Trump was the one pulling the trigger himself.

The Fallout and Legal Battles

Cohen outlines how the relationship deteriorated following the FBI raid on his home, hotel, and law office in 2018. He felt abandoned, with payments withheld under executive and officers insurance and no concern shown from Trump or his team. Cohen describes the people influencing Trump during this period—such as Jared Kushner, Steve Bannon, and Ryan Priebus—as enablers who convinced Trump to cut ties with him. He details feeling coerced and pressured into testifying against Trump, although he maintains the term "flip" is misleading as he insists he only answered questions under subpoena. Cohen elaborates on his time in federal prison, including harsh conditions like solitary confinement and the physical and emotional toll it took, contributing to his post-traumatic stress disorder.

Media and Public Perception

Throughout the conversation, Cohen reflects on the challenges of public perception. He acknowledges being canceled by both the political left and right, losing media platforms, and facing backlash depending on what stance he takes publicly. He discusses the pressures from media companies and their audiences, particularly highlighting his firing from Midas Touch, a platform with a predominantly left-leaning audience that objected to some of his pro-Trump comments. Cohen criticizes the media ecosystem that profits from controversy and public division while attacking him relentlessly.

Professional Background and Business Ventures

Before his full-time involvement with Trump, Cohen shares his background in law and business, including owning tens of millions of dollars in taxi medallions in New York and Chicago and buying properties in Trump World Tower as investments. He explains how his entrance into Trump's orbit came through a connection with Donald Trump Jr. during a dispute with a building board. Cohen also recounts his roles beyond legal counsel, such as sitting on the board of the Miss Universe Organization and co-president of Trump Productions, highlighting the deep professional integration with Trump's empire.

Insights on Trump's Character and Leadership

Cohen describes Trump as a loyal leader who expects loyalty in return and someone who likes familiarity in his inner circle. While he acknowledges Trump's harsh and often unforgiving nature—never apologizing even for mistakes—he argues Trump's leadership has consistency, comparing it to his time at the Trump Organization. Cohen contends that Trump's ability to control leverage and pressure others extends from business to politics, specifically referencing university litigations as an example. He articulates that as president, Trump applies the same aggressive negotiation tactics he used in business.

The 2011 Decision and Path to Presidency

Cohen describes the early stages leading to Trump's presidential bid, explaining that in 2011 Trump had a low public probability of running but they actively gauged public interest through initiatives like the "shouldtrumprun.com" website, which surprisingly garnered massive attention. Cohen recalls Trump's strategic discussions about the political landscape, including his views on Obama's presidency and foreign policy. He shares Trump's superstitious nature, drawing parallels to sports like baseball.

The University Litigations and Trump's Leverage

An interesting subject covered is Cohen's recent advisement to university presidents, including those from Big Ten schools, on how to handle lawsuits and federal pressure led by Trump's administration, particularly over funding and educational issues. Cohen advises settling early to mitigate escalating financial pressure, explaining Trump's unrelenting approach to leverage. Cohen refrains from naming many institutions but indicates the stakes are high, especially for smaller schools reliant on government funding.

Views on the Justice System and Government Pressure

Cohen voices profound skepticism about the justice system, arguing it is a mechanism often wielded by those in power to serve their agendas rather than deliver true justice. He discusses his own experience feeling pressured, threatened, and coerced by prosecutors determined to secure convictions, highlighting the imbalance of power when facing government entities. He critiques the culture of high conviction rates by prosecutors, framing it as systemic leverage rather than meritocracy.

Political Views and Bipartisanship

Though Cohen identifies as slightly left of center and a lifelong Democrat, he embraces certain bipartisan stances, such as supporting Trump's call for second chances and reforms related to federal criminal justice. He discusses co-authoring a proposal—the Trump Emancipation Proclamation Order—aimed at removing the stigma from nonviolent felons who have completed their sentences, advocating for their reintegration into society. He also commends Trump's willingness to engage with political opponents like Elizabeth Warren and Chuck Schumer, praising such pragmatism despite personal disdain for some figures.

Personal Support and Trust

Addressing who supports him today, Cohen notes that unwavering trust lies primarily within his immediate family and a few long-time friends, while expressing sadness over a lack of trust within broader public or political circles. He acknowledges having supporters on social media but laments the polarizing effects of his positions that have led to cancellations and criticism from both sides of the political spectrum. Nonetheless, he emphasizes the loyalty of his oldest friendships and his own commitment to honesty regardless of consequences.

Controversies and Allegations

Cohen confronts allegations linking him to matters involving Jeffrey Epstein, categorically denying any involvement or knowledge of Epstein in Trump's inner circle during his tenure. He details handling a fraudulent Jane Doe lawsuit against Trump, which was abandoned after investigative efforts revealed inconsistencies including a vacant lot as the supposed address. He rebuffs accusations that he threatened anyone related to these cases, arguing that such claims are unfounded and represent part of the unfair vilification he faces.

Reflections on Loyalty and Betrayal

A recurring theme is Cohen's reflection on loyalty—how he gave 100% loyalty to Trump but felt that it was not reciprocated during his legal struggles. He draws on his experience in tough business environments and the taxi industry to frame expectations around loyalty and protection within powerful circles. Cohen criticizes Trump's inner circle for betraying him and driving a wedge between him and the president, expressing a longing for reconciliation but also uncertainty about how such a dialogue would unfold.

Prospects for Reconciliation and Future Plans

Toward the episode's end, Cohen candidly discusses the possibility of reaching out to Trump again. He is uncertain what he would say but acknowledges that a phone call is possible and may be necessary. He also outlines his ambitions for pushing through the criminal justice reform proposal that could help millions of Americans. Cohen expresses hope that, with time, Trump might come to recognize his steadfastness and perhaps reconnect despite the painful history.

Views on Immigration, Border Security, and International Affairs

Cohen offers nuanced opinions on immigration and border security, agreeing with the need for strong borders and enforcement but criticizing certain enforcement tactics that infringe on constitutional rights. He discusses the complexities of cooperation between federal immigration authorities and local jurisdictions. Regarding international issues, he voices skepticism about military actions in Venezuela and Brazil, illustrating awareness of regime change debates and acknowledging regional instability he witnessed firsthand. Cohen underscores the difficult balance between American global involvement and respecting national sovereignty.

The Human Side and Personal Anecdotes

Throughout the episode, Cohen shares personal stories that reveal his human side beyond headline controversies. From cooking lasagna for Ivanka Trump and their sibling-like banter, to his close bonds with friends from childhood and even connections made during incarceration, Cohen illustrates facets of loyalty, camaraderie, and pain. He acknowledges the emotional toll of his experiences, including PTSD, while vowing to remain authentic and true to his lived experience.

Relationship with the Trump Family

Cohen paints a complicated picture of his relationship with Trump's family. He recalls moments of closeness with Donald Jr., Ivanka, and Eric, including involvement on Eric's charity board. However, he expresses hurt over their subsequent distance and silence amid his legal troubles, describing exchanges where Ivanka avoided eye contact. These dynamics add another layer to the personal and professional fractures that shaped his current position.

Legacy and Public Impact

Lastly, Cohen reflects on his legacy and the broader implications of his actions and experiences. He asserts his desire to contribute positively, particularly in criminal justice reform, while acknowledging the costs he has endured—cancellation, loss of trust, and personal hardship. He challenges critics to focus on facts rather than innuendo and insists that his allegiance is to the truth as he knows it, regardless of how politically inconvenient it may be.