Glenn Greenwald | PBD Podcast | Ep. 298

Added: Aug 27, 2023

Greenwald emphasizes the importance of independent media in challenging the narratives put forth by these power centers. He believes that preserving spaces for dissent and alternative viewpoints is crucial for a functioning democracy. However, he notes that the media landscape is often controlled by these same power centers, leading to the suppression of dissenting voices and the promotion of establishment narratives. The conversation then turns to the surveillance state and the erosion of civil liberties. Greenwald explains that after the 9/11 attacks, there was a bipartisan effort to rein in the powers of the security state. However, this effort was ultimately thwarted by the Obama administration and subsequent administrations. He argues that fear and propaganda have been used to justify the expansion of surveillance and control over the population. Greenwald also discusses the role of hackers in exposing the actions of those in power. While there have been instances of hacking and leaks that have shed light on government activities, he points out that the media often downplays or dismisses these revelations. He suggests that the media is complicit in protecting the interests of the power centers and obscuring the truth. The conversation then delves into the question of who holds the most power in society. Greenwald argues that it is not a single individual but a confluence of power centers that work together to maintain the status quo. He mentions institutions like BlackRock, Goldman Sachs, and JP Morgan as examples of powerful economic entities. He also highlights the influence of the military-industrial complex and the intelligence community. The podcast continues with a discussion on the challenges faced by politicians who seek to challenge the power centers. Greenwald explains that career politicians are often corrupted by the system and serve the interests of the establishment. Even outsiders like Donald Trump, who promised to shake up the system, were ultimately co-opted by the power centers. He suggests that a genuine challenge to the power centers would require a concerted effort to wage a war on the fourth branch of government, which he identifies as the permanent power faction in Washington. Greenwald continues by analyzing the winners of the debate, with different sources naming different candidates. He speculates on whether former President Donald Trump will show up to the next debate and discusses the popularity of Florida Governor Ron DeSantis among Republicans. The conversation then shifts to the potential pardoning of Julian Assange and Edward Snowden. Greenwald expresses disappointment that Trump did not pardon Snowden and explains that the reason for this was pressure from Republican senators who threatened to vote to convict Trump if he pardoned Snowden. He believes that pardoning Assange and Snowden would be an act of courage and would symbolize a rejection of the secret and criminal activities of the US security state. Greenwald addresses skepticism about Snowden's safety in Russia and Putin's motivations. He argues that Snowden's actions and moral framework demonstrate his commitment to preventing mass surveillance and his willingness to go to prison for his beliefs. He also explains that Russia has a history of providing refuge to dissidents from the West and that it would be against their national identity to turn Snowden over to the US. The conversation then transitions to Brazil, where Greenwald currently resides. He discusses his affinity for the country and his admiration for Brazilian race car driver Ayrton Senna. He mentions Operation Car Wash, a corruption investigation in Brazil, and the downfall of a billionaire involved in the scandal. Greenwald also discusses the political landscape in Brazil, including the rise of President Jair Bolsonaro and the controversial former president Luiz Inácio Lula da Silva. Greenwald provides a detailed background on Lula, describing his rise from extreme poverty to becoming a union leader and eventually a political leftist. He highlights Lula's accomplishments during his presidency, such as reducing poverty and increasing access to education, but also acknowledges the systemic corruption that plagued his government. Greenwald explains that Lula's party, the PT, has always been associated with corruption, and Lula himself has faced allegations of stealing money from the government. However, he emphasizes the need for a fair trial to determine Lula's guilt or innocence, rather than relying solely on documented evidence. Similarly, Greenwald suggests that Bolsonaro and his family are also involved in corruption, pointing to their personal wealth and questionable financial activities. The conversation then shifts to the role of the media and the concept of ESG investing. Greenwald discusses the power of the media to shape public opinion and influence political outcomes. He criticizes the Brazilian court system for its censorship and anti-democratic practices, particularly the actions of Attorney General Alexandre de Moraes, whom Greenwald describes as a despot and fanatic. Regarding ESG investing, Greenwald expresses concern about its potential overreach and lack of economic merit. He cites the example of BlackRock, which has scaled back its support for ESG-related shareholder proposals, suggesting that many of these proposals were redundant or lacked long-term shareholder value. Greenwald argues that there is a growing public and shareholder demand for companies to move away from excessive diversity and equality measures.