Added: Aug 7, 2023
In this podcast episode, host Chris Williamson interviews Christine Emba, a columnist for The Washington Post, about her recent article on the crisis of masculinity. Emba discusses the unexpected attention her article received and the growing discussion around the issue of men's struggles in society.Emba explains that the article needed to be long because discussing the crisis of modern men is far from the typical cultural zeitgeist. She highlights the need to address the topic step by step, acknowledging various groups and caveats along the way. Emba also mentions that her editors had to cut down the article due to the numerous threads and angles involved in the discussion. The crisis of masculinity, according to Emba, stems from the significant societal changes that have occurred over the past few decades. While these changes have been positive for some groups, such as women, they have not been as beneficial for men, especially working-class men. Emba cites statistics on education, health, and wages to illustrate the challenges men face. She argues that these changes have left many men feeling lost and unsure of their place in the world. Emba also discusses the impact of cultural shifts on men's identity and role models. She notes that the media often portrays men in negative or unflattering ways, such as the male schlub archetype. This, combined with the reflexive push to label masculinity as toxic, has made it difficult for men to find positive role models and understand what it means to be a man in today's society. The conversation then delves into the structural and cultural changes that have disadvantaged men and led to a loss of their position and identity. Emba emphasizes the need for a better vision of masculinity and role models that men can look up to. She argues that many progressives have missed the opportunity to sell men on a positive vision of what they could be, leading to a dominance of right-leaning voices in the conversation. The podcast also touches on the challenges of discussing masculinity in mainstream media and the dominance of women's voices in the conversation. Emba suggests that women may be more inclined to think about social cues and gender norms, leading to their involvement in the discussion. She also acknowledges the branding problem associated with men's issues and the negative associations with the manosphere. Emba continues by highlighting the importance of offering men a better vision of masculinity and providing diverse role models. She argues that there should be multiple ways to be a good man, but it is crucial to have those models and not simply rely on the idea of being a good person. Emba shares an example from a conversation she had in Qatar, where she asked a gentleman about his opinion on Jordan Peterson and Joe Rogan as examples of what a man should be. The gentleman expressed his dislike for them but struggled to provide an alternative role model. Emba highlights the difficulty of finding role models that everyone can agree on, especially when political leanings come into play. The conversation then shifts to the politicization of discourse around masculinity. Emba mentions a video she made where she asked men about their role models, and many hesitated to mention well-known figures like Barack Obama or Mitt Romney due to the fear of being seen as supporting the "other team." This politicization hinders the recognition of objectively good role models. She also addresses the pushback against the idea of masculine traits and the belief that we should focus on being good people rather than emphasizing gender-specific qualities. However, she argues that we cannot ignore the existence of masculine traits and must recognize them in order to address them effectively. Towards the end of the podcast, the conversation briefly touches on the topic of rethinking sex and the fallout from the "Me Too" movement. They mention the importance of discussing consent, ceilings, and flaws in order to have a comprehensive understanding of gender dynamics. Overall, the podcast explores the crisis of masculinity, the challenges men face in today's society, and the need for a more nuanced and positive conversation about masculinity. Emba emphasizes the importance of providing men with role models and addressing their struggles to foster understanding and cooperation between the sexes.
