Dr. Lisa Feldman Barrett: How to Understand Emotions | Huberman Lab Podcast

Added: Oct 17, 2023

Dr. Barrett begins by highlighting the ongoing debate among scientists about the definition of emotions. She explains that emotions are often described as coordinated responses involving physiological changes, brain activity, and facial expressions. However, she argues that these features are not unique to emotions and can be observed in various contexts. Therefore, it is challenging to define emotions based solely on these components.

The conversation then shifts to the role of facial expressions in conveying emotions. Dr. Barrett challenges the notion that specific facial expressions are universally associated with particular emotional states. She explains that facial movements are not always expressions of internal states and that their meaning can vary depending on the context. Moreover, research has shown that facial expressions of emotions are highly variable across individuals and cultures, debunking the idea of universal facial expressions.

Dr. Barrett emphasizes the importance of understanding emotions in a broader context. She argues that emotions are not discrete entities but rather processes that involve a range of physiological and cognitive factors. Emotions are not fixed categories but rather dynamic and context-dependent experiences. Therefore, it is misleading to rely solely on facial expressions or other physical markers to determine someone's emotional state.

The discussion then delves into the limitations of language in capturing the complexity of emotions. Dr. Barrett agrees that language is insufficient for fully understanding and describing emotional states. She suggests that different languages and cultures may have unique ways of conceptualizing and expressing emotions. It is valuable to explore and learn from these diverse perspectives to enhance our understanding of emotions.

Dr. Barrett also highlights the potential consequences of relying on facial expressions to judge others' emotional states. She points out that this belief is deeply ingrained in Western culture and has even influenced legal systems. However, research has shown that facial expressions are not reliable indicators of internal emotional states. This misconception can lead to misinterpretations and unjust outcomes, as demonstrated in legal cases.

Dr. Barrett explains that the brain is constantly receiving signals from the sensory surfaces of the body, such as the retina, skin, and auditory system. These signals are the outcomes of various changes happening in the body and the external world. The brain's task is to guess the causes of these signals in order to stay alive and make decisions.

The brain constructs categories of possible futures based on past experiences and sensory signals. It does not label emotions as discrete states, but rather creates categories that are more fine-grained than simple emotions like anger or fear. These categories are multimodal summaries of sensory and motor features, and they vary in size and specificity.

The brain compresses the high-dimensional sensory signals into low-dimensional summaries as it processes information. This compression happens along the cortical sheet, where neurons representing low-level details give way to larger neurons representing more abstract features. This compression is lossy, meaning that some information is lost in the process.

Dr. Barrett emphasizes that emotions are not static states that are labeled by the brain. Instead, the brain constructs categories of possible futures and makes guesses about the specific sensory and motor patterns that are relevant in a given situation. These guesses are made at every synapse in the brain, from the cortex to the midbrain to the brainstem and spinal cord.

The brain's ultimate goal is to reduce uncertainty and make decisions about whether to move, which direction to move, and how fast to move. However, this is not the only decision the brain has to make. It also has to decide how to coordinate internal actions, such as heart rate and blood pressure, to support the motor movements.

Dr. Barrett also discusses the plasticity of the brain and how cultural and developmental experiences shape our emotional responses. She suggests that the complexity of emotional responses can expand and contract over time, influenced by factors such as authoritarianism and societal changes.

She raises concerns about the current trend of reducing emotions to simple categories, such as emojis, and argues that this oversimplification does not accurately reflect the complexity of the brain's emotional processing. She suggests that expanding the number of different emotional responses and understanding the nuances of emotions can lead to a more accurate understanding of how the brain works.

Dr. Barrett emphasizes that emotions are not separate from the body but are constructed by the brain based on sensory signals. She explains that words are used to communicate and categorize our experiences, and they stand in for a set of features that are similar to each other. For example, the word "pizza" represents a variety of sensory and motor features related to the food.

She also discusses the concept of affect, which is a low-dimensional summary of the body's sensory state. Affect represents the barometer of the body's state, whether it is feeling pleasant, unpleasant, worked up, calm, comfortable, or uncomfortable. The brain uses affect as a basis for constructing emotions and making predictions about future sensations.

Dr. Barrett highlights the importance of flexibility in dealing with emotions. Sometimes it is useful to feel and acknowledge our feelings, while other times it may be more beneficial to shift our attention or engage in physical activities like running. The key is to understand our goals and choose the appropriate response based on the situation.

She challenges the notion that emotions are solely experienced in the body, stating that everything we feel is actually experienced in the brain. The brain receives sensory signals from the body and constructs our conscious experience based on those signals. She also cautions against pathologizing physical sensations, as they can sometimes be productive and informative.

Dr. Barrett shares an example of her own experience when she felt a high level of arousal due to uncertainty during the COVID-19 pandemic. She recognized that the discomfort she was feeling was related to uncertainty rather than anxiety, and this understanding helped her make informed decisions.

She also discusses the importance of expanding our understanding of emotions by adding dimensionality to our descriptions and creating new internal labels. By shifting our attention and focusing on different sensory aspects of our body, we can change the dimensionality of our experience and gain more control over our emotions.

Dr. Barrett mentions the work of Oliver Sacks, who explored different sensory experiences to gain empathy and understanding for his patients. By considering how animals experience the world through different senses, we can develop a broader perspective on reality and the diversity of human experiences.

She introduces the concept of affect, which refers to the feeling of pleasantness or unpleasantness that accompanies an emotion. She explains that affect is not just a mental state, but is tied to the body's physiological state. Affect is the brain's belief about the metabolic state of the body, and it can be influenced by factors such as fatigue, hydration, and nutrition.

She emphasizes the importance of understanding affect and recognizing that feeling unpleasant or fatigued does not necessarily mean that something is wrong. It may simply indicate that one is working hard and needs to push through. Taking care of the body's physical needs, such as drinking water, eating, and getting enough sleep, can help replenish the body's resources and improve affect.

Dr. Barrett also discusses the relationship between affect and uncertainty. She explains that when one feels worked up or uncertain, it can lead to unpleasant affect. However, she cautions against always interpreting affect as a sign that something is wrong in the world. Sometimes, affect is simply a reflection of the body's physical state, and addressing those physical needs can help improve affect.

She shares a personal anecdote about her daughter's experience with depression and how addressing her physical needs, such as giving her ibuprofen and allowing her to sleep, helped improve her mood. Dr. Barrett emphasizes that depression is a metabolic illness and that the symptoms of depression are related to metabolic deficits in the body.

Dr. Barrett also discusses the importance of sleep, exercise, nutrition, and social connection for mental and physical health. She explains that getting a good night's sleep, eating healthfully, and engaging in regular exercise can have a significant impact on affect and overall well-being. She also emphasizes the role of social connection in regulating the nervous system and improving affect.

She highlights the importance of trust and positive relationships in regulating each other's nervous systems. When people feel safe and supported in their relationships, it can have a positive impact on their affect and overall mental health. Conversely, negative or toxic relationships can be taxing on the nervous system.

Dr. Barrett also discusses the role of kindness and random acts of kindness in improving affect. She shares an example of how baking bread for her neighbor made her feel good and created a positive interaction. Kindness can provide a body budgeting benefit and improve overall well-being.